wherein Liz reads the NFE archive and thinks about gift exchange commentary etiquette

[edenfalling]

I have been reading through this year's Narnia Fic Exchange stories with great enjoyment. I am not done yet, even though there are only twenty-five of them. This is because I try to take more time with gift exchange fics, and leave thoughtful comments.

I think I do that partly as a sort of interest payment on my normal utter failure at leaving feedback ("kudos" and "like" options are a godsend, seriously), and partly because I know that I spend the anonymous portion of such fests twitchy and nervous, wondering if people will like my work without my name attached to it. I mean, not that I have all that much name recognition to start with, but I have a little simply by virtue of kicking around various fandoms for twelve years now. There is value in being a known quantity. And I figure that if I feel nervous, at least some other writers probably do too, so I want to say, "Yes, people are reading your work and responding positively!"

This can, of course, get tricky with some stories, depending on the subject matter and the writer's skill level, but there is always something you can pick out and say, "I liked this metaphor," or "I liked how happy everyone seemed," or "You got the melancholy mood across very clearly," or "I had never thought of X that way, but you have convinced me it's an interpretation worth examining," etcetera ad infinitum. And you just shut up and don't mention the parts that are Not Your Ship, Not Your Kink, Not Your Writing Style, or whatever, unless you know the writer is okay with concrit in a public arena... which, given that the stories are usually anonymous at the time, you have no way to be sure of. So be polite. :-)

(I guess this maybe sounds like I advocate fraudulent praise as payment for participation? That's not what I mean, though. My praise can be extremely selective in focus -- I would never deny that -- but if I say I liked an element of a story, I honestly mean that I liked that element.)

Comments

[lady_songsmith]

I am now rereading your comment on mine with some amusement for how... focused... it is. (It's ok; I will be the very first to admit this was not one of my better fics.)

[edenfalling]

If it was a ship-centric story, my narrow focus has nothing to do with your writing and everything to do with my approach to Narnia fandom in general. You see, while I am not much of a shipper in any context, Narnia fandom has an unusually high percentage of Not My Ship. (It's mostly disinterest rather than NoTP, but still.) I am not into Caspian/Any Pevensie, nor any form of Pevencest, nor am I particularly into Digory/Polly, Jill/Rilian, Jill/Tirian, Susan/Peridan, Susan/Lune, Jadis/Anyone, or Bacchus/Anyone, which knocks out the vast majority of potential ships right there. I do like Aravis/Cor, and I think Jill/Eustace can be cute, but beyond that Narnia is pretty much my Platonic ideal of a gen fandom. Lewis didn't write sex or romance, and whatever his motives, I have always found that lack extraordinarily refreshing. For me, Narnia is a little asexual oasis in the middle of a world obsessed with romantic and sexual forms of love. :-)

So I'll read pretty much anything, because the flip side of disinterest is that I don't care enough to strongly dislike much of anything (as a reader, anyway), but the shipping is never going to be what sells a Narnia story to me. *wry*

[lady_songsmith]

Without going into details against the spirit of the anonymous period: it was a ship-fic. It was also Not My Ship, in about the same way -- not a NoTP, but not something I'm particularly into either. However, my list of Will Not Write is very small in this fandom, so I always end my offer with an 'or anything, really' (in the AO3 format, I made a couple specific offers and one any/any offer). This results in some years with a very great deal of flailing around going "but I don't know how to WRITE that!" OTOH, I came out of one exchange a couple years back having written myself into actually shipping a pairing I started out indifferent to, so. :)

[edenfalling]

You are braver than I am, in that case! I usually say upfront that I won't write any Caspian/Pevensie or Pevensie/Pevensie ship, because while I am sure I could, if pressed, the process would be very awkward and difficult and probably the results would not be to the recipient's taste. :-(

I am much more likely to offer "anything!" for Yuletide, since optional details are optional and I can always go for a gen escape hatch if faced with a ship I can't wrap my head around.

[heliopausa]

Twenty-five stories take quite a time to read! (And some of them are whoppers.) I think I'm about halfway through. :D (And I got a simply gorgeous story as a gift. I'll write more about it in my next post.)

Yes, for sure it's a good thing to leave comments in gift exchanges, much more than for plain voluntary postings. Obviously it's plain courtesy to thank the writer for the story that's specifically written as a gift, but other than that, in an exchange I think there's more reason to read and leave reviews about all the stories. After all, it's something like a party game,isn't it? People are writing to other people's taste, not their own -- ships they'd never ship, eras they really don't enjoy....

(No-one has the time for this, but I just had the idea for a party game where we all write bad fics,and the game is to try to find something good to say about them, as in: I thought that the font you chose was beautifully uniform... :D )

Absolutely of course re: not writing anything fraudulent, but also I totally agree that it would be a rare fic that didn't have some interesting and enjoyable aspect to it, and in the exchange environment that's what to focus on in a review.

In ordinary fanficcery, if you don't like something, then you just pass by in silence (unless you're one of those-who-shall-not-be-named). If I do like something, I'll say so in a review, but I'll also make suggestions where I think it would be wanted (This part is tricky! but I did it the other day, for example, on an ffnet story). But the suggestion would always be a smaller part of an overall positive review. But not in an Exchange.

And thank you so much for opening a discussion on this! I often feel at sea with etiquette in fanfic world generally.

[rthstewart]

Reviewing, lack of reviewing, especially when friends (like people who know your real name) not reviewing, and all the basic angst associated with OH I COULDN'T POSSIBLY KNOW WHAT TO SAY. Meh. it's so little effort by the reviewer to say something and it means so very much to the recipient -- in the balance, I find it skews heavily in favor of leaving a comment or review. I'm totally with you on this and I don't worry about the fraudulent praise thing -- I find everything has some merit, in something, and even if it's not my favorite flavor of delicious cake, reading outside my normal comfort zone is good for me and it's in the spirit of this particular exchange. There's only one that I've read where I though, hmmm. and that was for what I suspect was a less mature writer. And I wouldn't dream of leveling critique there. Reap and sow, I guess. Though I do wish that people were being, generally, more generous in their comments, as in not commenting at all. Some stories aren't getting a lot of love and that's always sad for me.

I'm not sure if I've read your fic yet. I suspect not. I'm working through them. I'll review every one. My praise for the ones I love is certainly more effusive and longer. But just participating and turning in a story on time is worthy of something! That's more than a fair number of people managed.

[edenfalling]

Ahahaha, a deliberate bad!fic exchange. Pffft. That's beautiful. But yeah, there are other things I would rather do with my time.

Exchanges definitely push people outside their comfort zones -- sometimes more than others, but you're always, by definition, writing to somebody else's interests rather than writing something you would have come up with on your own. And I do think that work should be recognized! Also, the more positive feedback there is, the better people feel about participating, which means a greater chance that the exchange will continue. And I really like NFE, so... :-)

There are a lot of stories I open and then back-button out of in silence. There are others I read to the end and am left saying, essentially, "Meh," in which case I also leave in silence. Life is too short to go around telling people all the ways they are Doing Fiction Wrong -- especially since "wrong" almost always really means "not to my taste," and arguing about taste is one of the dumbest and most futile things people have ever wasted time on.

Every fandom is going to have its own preferred etiquette quirks, but I think the two main things that will keep you out of kerfuffles are to avoid arguments over ships or kinks -- in other words, Your Ship/Kink Is Not My Ship/Kink, And That's Okay! -- and to ask before leaving concrit in the comments of a story or artwork unless the creator has specifically said they want concrit there. (Making a critical review on your own journal/blog/website is a different issue, but not a lot of people do that kind of analysis within fandom so it doesn't come up very often.)

Anyway, I've been reading the NFE fics in reverse length order -- from shortest to longest -- so while I have only a handful left, they probably equal all the ones so far in combined wordcount. I hope to finish them on Wednesday or Thursday, and have some time left for writing at least one quick Madness fill. :-)

[edenfalling]

Oh god, I remember the stuff I wrote from about, hmm, twelve to eighteen, and ye gods I would not show most of it to anyone for love nor money. (I am so glad I didn't discover fanfiction until I was twenty, so all my early stuff is original and exists nowhere but on my computer or on printouts in my filing cabinet.) But you have to write badly in order to learn how to write better, and it's a lot easier to improve without people telling you you're terrible and should give up. :-(

I am working my way through from the shortest story to the longest, and I will review ALL OF THEM (except my own work, obviously) in the end. *resolve face* As you say, people put a lot of effort into the exchange -- it's not easy to write stories to somebody else's specifications, after all -- and that deserves recognition. And yeah, I have never yet found a story about which I couldn't find at least one positive thing to say. They cannot all be my perfect cup of tea, but hey, there are other drinks in the world and experimentation is good for the soul. :-)

[lady_songsmith]

Behold, I give you both the Bad Bang! http://archiveofourown.org/collections/BadBangTest

[edenfalling]

Oh my god. That. I just. WHAT.

*clicks through works in helpless fascination*

[heliopausa]

Good heavens! :) I've just looked at the picture called 'Constance saves the day', purporting to show the Three Musketeers; the comments were very skilled indeed! i.e. in being positive under great difficulties.

Thank you for expanding my horizons!

[lady_songsmith]

Amazing what a group of fans can do when they get caught in an encouragement feedback loop, innit? :D It came about pretty much the same way: someone made a joke, someone else picked it up...

[heliopausa]

Hhhmm... well,I'm going to have to start putting "concrit welcome" on things, because I really do want to know how to write more effectively. (Again, not in Exchanges - party games are not where you ask people for tips to improve your tail-pinning-on-donkey aim or whatever.)

I've never been in a kerfuffle (ie in fanfic. :D least said, soonest mended about the rest of my life.) I would love to see critical reviews of fanfics (presumably not one at a time, but looking at movements within, or whatever), but I don't imagine such will happen,mostly because the people most interested are using their energy to write it,not crit it.

As for reading, I'm about two-thirds through, I think -- I still have at least one of the long ones to go. I can't see myself managing a Madness fill.

[edenfalling]

Oh hey, I just remembered a thing! If you want critical perspectives on fanfiction (by which I mean academic criticism and stuff), you should look through all the issues of Transformative Works and Cultures, which is a journal full of scholarly articles about fandom, run by the OTW (the organization behind AO3). I find some of their work a bit too jargon-heavy for my taste, and of course other articles either deal with fandoms I'm not in or come to conclusions I don't completely agree with, but it's very thought-provoking, and I love that there IS an entire journal dedicated to taking fannish endeavors completely seriously and from within the culture rather than without.

[heliopausa]

Thank you. :) I've opened it up, and am starting (just sorting through) at the 2008 issue. And yes, agreed re the taking seriously, and from the inside.

[hungrytiger11.livejournal.com]

I think that is incredibly kind- and it does not sound like you are advocating empty praise. Rather, it is like you would thank someone for a gift (not that all readers are the named recipient but we are all enjoying a story the writer may not have otherwise written), so finding at least one good thing about every story seems very good.

[edenfalling]

Thanks for gifts! Yeah, that's the concept I was failing to put into words. Somebody wrote a story as a present, which they would not otherwise have written, and so I like to show appreciation for that. And I have never yet found a story I could not say at least one true and positive thing about. :-)