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edenfallingI am not talking about the big HP 'resolve/explicate old wanks' thing, really... but it's fascinating reading and it kicked off a number of thought trains in my head.
Anyway. It's weird to read about Gryffindor Tower, because I have mixed feelings about that site. I disliked an astonishingly high proportion of their stories, yet I like H/G, and Gryffindor Tower kicked me into writing fanfiction in the first place. I would probably have ended up writing fanfiction even without Gryffindor Tower's existence, but it would have been much later, and what I would have written would likely have been very different.
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I suppose I always had vague fannish impulses. That is, I would go through serial obsessions with various stories, in which I devoured them and temporarily became an expert on their fictional worlds and characters. I mostly concentrated on books, but I briefly flirted with TV series during seasons 2-4 of BtVS and season 1 of Angel. (I stopped watching because of scheduling conflicts, not because of any sudden coolness toward the shows.) Once I went so far as to dream up a self-insertion/Mary Sue epic sequel to Pamela Service's The Winter of Magic's Return and Tomorrow's Magic (which are lovely and fun, by the way, as are most of Service's stories, and you ought to read them) but I never did anything about those impulses, or made use of my temporary encyclopediac knowledge. I just read things, enjoyed them, and spent hours figuring out how the worlds and stories would really hang together.
Then I went to college and discovered the internet.
I gradually became aware that there was such a thing as an online fannish community, and that this involved writing stories about, or set in the world of, various 'real' stories. (Yes, this is a skewed understanding. Bear with me and remember I had no direct experience at that point.) And in February 2002, in the middle of one of my depressive periods, I stumbled onto actual Harry Potter fanfiction.
This had two vectors. First, I ran across an article decrying the existence of fanfiction stories in which underage characters were sexualized and put into *gasp* romantic relationships. This aroused my curiosity. Second, I stumbled across Cassandra Claire's "Very Secret Diaries."
(In retrospect, having the "Very Secret Diaries" as an entry-point into fandom probably helps explain why I was never particularly bothered by slash. Then again, my tendency to assume that people are mostly asexual unless proven otherwise, and my own vague bisexuality probably explain more. Whatever.)
At some point, Cassandra Claire linked to the "Draco Trilogy," whichever one she was working on at the time, and I, curious, followed the link. From there, I joined a few Yahoo! groups, where I eagerly read Lori's trilogy, Heidi's stories, Ebony/AngieJ's "Paradise" stories, and so on. Then I discovered FictionAlley. I was hooked.
After a month or so, it occurred to me that all the stories I'd been reading were based on a Harry/Hermione romantic relationship. (Well, okay, Heidi's is Draco/Hermione, and "Trouble in Paradise" starts out R/Hr, but it's a very dysfunctional R/Hr and that's not the underlying ship.) And I wondered if I was reading H/Hr because I actually liked it, or because I just hadn't tried the alternatives.
----------------
Here I pause and say that the first three books -- PS/SS, CoS, and PoA -- seemed completely romance-free to me, with the exceptions of Ginny's crush on Harry (played for humor), Hermione's crush on Lockhart (played for humor), and Harry's crush on Cho (blink and you miss it). In GoF, it seemed clear to me that Harry liked Cho, Hermione and Viktor liked each other, and there was some sort of tension between Ron and Hermione, though neither of them had any real idea what it was or how to deal with it.
My response was basically to shrug and say, "Whatever." If Rowling felt like putting Ron and Hermione together, I didn't care one way or the other, because that's not why I was reading the books. I was reading because I liked Harry, because I liked the plot (mostly), because I liked the world, because I liked Rowling's tone (she has a deft touch with whimsy), and because I liked the genre-clash of high fantasy and traditional British boarding school stories.
I also am not a huge fan of romance in stories -- I can take it or leave it, unless I'm deliberately reading Harlequin soupies -- so I had no inclination to hunt down any potential romantic subtext.
----------------
With that background understood, you'll probably understand why most of the R/Hr stories I read on SugarQuill left me indifferent, despite their generally high quality. I just don't care that much about Ron and Hermione on their own. I care about Harry. We see the world through Harry's POV, so I identify with him, even though I'm not particularly similar to him. I usually identify with main characters this way; it's just how I react to stories.
Then I tried reading Harry/Ginny stories, since that seemed to be the other really popular ship. Gryffindor Tower was by far the largest collection of H/G, so I took a stab at a number of their stories.
And... I didn't like them. In some cases, I hated them.
Weirdly, though, I discovered that I quite liked the concept of H/G. I just really, really disliked the way most Gryffindor Tower authors wrote it. They had a collective interpretation of Ginny's character that I didn't agree with, and a set of tropes -- sock-stealing, encounters with people who were only dressed in small towels, boxers, etc. -- that irritated the hell out of me. They also had a penchant for undying love, IncrediblyPowerful!Ginny, teenage soulmates, teen pregnancy (usually portrayed as a good thing!), and other themes that bother me for various reasons.
So, in April 2002, I decided to write my own take on H/G: Five Years Is an Awful Lot of Later. That got me thinking about Ginny in general, which led me to start writing "Secrets," and somehow I've just kept on writing and stumbling, piecemeal, into more fandoms.
----------------
Anyway, during my explorations, I did discover that I liked H/Hr more than R/Hr, even though I was fairly sure that R/Hr would become canon at some point. I was never convinced, however, that R/Hr would be a particularly healthy relationship, nor that it would last. I know JKR has a theme of people marrying their high-school sweethearts, but just because she thinks that's a good idea doesn't mean it really does work for everybody. I remain unconvinced that it would work for Hermione and Ron. And while I think Harry and Ginny could end up happy together, I think Harry could have an equally good (if very different) romantic relationship with Hermione.
But you know, I never have understood why people got so invested in having 'their' ship win out in canon. That sort of thing has always seemed pointless to me. The author will write what he or she wants to write, and then you read the new canon and deal with it. Since so much of fandom discussion, back in those days, seemed to revolve around shipping, I learned to stay out of it. All I cared about was the stories, and in those stories, I cared more about characterization and plot than about romance.
This is, to a great extent, all I've ever cared about. It's why I fell into fandom in the first place. And if I don't like a story, I don't have to read it. If somebody prefers ships that I don't care about, it's no skin off my back.
I have certain issues on which I have a driving need to be 'correct.' Shipping is not one of them.
And I am so, so grateful that it isn't.
Anyway. It's weird to read about Gryffindor Tower, because I have mixed feelings about that site. I disliked an astonishingly high proportion of their stories, yet I like H/G, and Gryffindor Tower kicked me into writing fanfiction in the first place. I would probably have ended up writing fanfiction even without Gryffindor Tower's existence, but it would have been much later, and what I would have written would likely have been very different.
----------------
I suppose I always had vague fannish impulses. That is, I would go through serial obsessions with various stories, in which I devoured them and temporarily became an expert on their fictional worlds and characters. I mostly concentrated on books, but I briefly flirted with TV series during seasons 2-4 of BtVS and season 1 of Angel. (I stopped watching because of scheduling conflicts, not because of any sudden coolness toward the shows.) Once I went so far as to dream up a self-insertion/Mary Sue epic sequel to Pamela Service's The Winter of Magic's Return and Tomorrow's Magic (which are lovely and fun, by the way, as are most of Service's stories, and you ought to read them) but I never did anything about those impulses, or made use of my temporary encyclopediac knowledge. I just read things, enjoyed them, and spent hours figuring out how the worlds and stories would really hang together.
Then I went to college and discovered the internet.
I gradually became aware that there was such a thing as an online fannish community, and that this involved writing stories about, or set in the world of, various 'real' stories. (Yes, this is a skewed understanding. Bear with me and remember I had no direct experience at that point.) And in February 2002, in the middle of one of my depressive periods, I stumbled onto actual Harry Potter fanfiction.
This had two vectors. First, I ran across an article decrying the existence of fanfiction stories in which underage characters were sexualized and put into *gasp* romantic relationships. This aroused my curiosity. Second, I stumbled across Cassandra Claire's "Very Secret Diaries."
(In retrospect, having the "Very Secret Diaries" as an entry-point into fandom probably helps explain why I was never particularly bothered by slash. Then again, my tendency to assume that people are mostly asexual unless proven otherwise, and my own vague bisexuality probably explain more. Whatever.)
At some point, Cassandra Claire linked to the "Draco Trilogy," whichever one she was working on at the time, and I, curious, followed the link. From there, I joined a few Yahoo! groups, where I eagerly read Lori's trilogy, Heidi's stories, Ebony/AngieJ's "Paradise" stories, and so on. Then I discovered FictionAlley. I was hooked.
After a month or so, it occurred to me that all the stories I'd been reading were based on a Harry/Hermione romantic relationship. (Well, okay, Heidi's is Draco/Hermione, and "Trouble in Paradise" starts out R/Hr, but it's a very dysfunctional R/Hr and that's not the underlying ship.) And I wondered if I was reading H/Hr because I actually liked it, or because I just hadn't tried the alternatives.
----------------
Here I pause and say that the first three books -- PS/SS, CoS, and PoA -- seemed completely romance-free to me, with the exceptions of Ginny's crush on Harry (played for humor), Hermione's crush on Lockhart (played for humor), and Harry's crush on Cho (blink and you miss it). In GoF, it seemed clear to me that Harry liked Cho, Hermione and Viktor liked each other, and there was some sort of tension between Ron and Hermione, though neither of them had any real idea what it was or how to deal with it.
My response was basically to shrug and say, "Whatever." If Rowling felt like putting Ron and Hermione together, I didn't care one way or the other, because that's not why I was reading the books. I was reading because I liked Harry, because I liked the plot (mostly), because I liked the world, because I liked Rowling's tone (she has a deft touch with whimsy), and because I liked the genre-clash of high fantasy and traditional British boarding school stories.
I also am not a huge fan of romance in stories -- I can take it or leave it, unless I'm deliberately reading Harlequin soupies -- so I had no inclination to hunt down any potential romantic subtext.
----------------
With that background understood, you'll probably understand why most of the R/Hr stories I read on SugarQuill left me indifferent, despite their generally high quality. I just don't care that much about Ron and Hermione on their own. I care about Harry. We see the world through Harry's POV, so I identify with him, even though I'm not particularly similar to him. I usually identify with main characters this way; it's just how I react to stories.
Then I tried reading Harry/Ginny stories, since that seemed to be the other really popular ship. Gryffindor Tower was by far the largest collection of H/G, so I took a stab at a number of their stories.
And... I didn't like them. In some cases, I hated them.
Weirdly, though, I discovered that I quite liked the concept of H/G. I just really, really disliked the way most Gryffindor Tower authors wrote it. They had a collective interpretation of Ginny's character that I didn't agree with, and a set of tropes -- sock-stealing, encounters with people who were only dressed in small towels, boxers, etc. -- that irritated the hell out of me. They also had a penchant for undying love, IncrediblyPowerful!Ginny, teenage soulmates, teen pregnancy (usually portrayed as a good thing!), and other themes that bother me for various reasons.
So, in April 2002, I decided to write my own take on H/G: Five Years Is an Awful Lot of Later. That got me thinking about Ginny in general, which led me to start writing "Secrets," and somehow I've just kept on writing and stumbling, piecemeal, into more fandoms.
----------------
Anyway, during my explorations, I did discover that I liked H/Hr more than R/Hr, even though I was fairly sure that R/Hr would become canon at some point. I was never convinced, however, that R/Hr would be a particularly healthy relationship, nor that it would last. I know JKR has a theme of people marrying their high-school sweethearts, but just because she thinks that's a good idea doesn't mean it really does work for everybody. I remain unconvinced that it would work for Hermione and Ron. And while I think Harry and Ginny could end up happy together, I think Harry could have an equally good (if very different) romantic relationship with Hermione.
But you know, I never have understood why people got so invested in having 'their' ship win out in canon. That sort of thing has always seemed pointless to me. The author will write what he or she wants to write, and then you read the new canon and deal with it. Since so much of fandom discussion, back in those days, seemed to revolve around shipping, I learned to stay out of it. All I cared about was the stories, and in those stories, I cared more about characterization and plot than about romance.
This is, to a great extent, all I've ever cared about. It's why I fell into fandom in the first place. And if I don't like a story, I don't have to read it. If somebody prefers ships that I don't care about, it's no skin off my back.
I have certain issues on which I have a driving need to be 'correct.' Shipping is not one of them.
And I am so, so grateful that it isn't.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
(no subject)
Date: 2006-06-21 11:56 pm (UTC)and a set of inbred tropes -- sock-stealing, encounters with people who were only dressed in small towels, boxers, etc. -- that irritated the hell out of me.
Sock-stealing? XDDD
Ah, I never wandered too far into the het side of things, though reading about msscribe and GF now makes me really cranky and weirded out by the Evil and Idiocy of people and such (though I was never personally invested in HP fandom, however much I read....) But it does annoy me whenever particular fanon details gets so ingrained it's like no one can write a story about X without paying homage to it, like they've lost track of the canon and, what's more, are incapable of coming up with new fanon—or if not relatively minor details, whole character interpretations that are decidedly off to start with, and only have being out there first to go for them. >:|
(no subject)
Date: 2006-06-22 12:35 am (UTC)There was also a persistent theme of Harry suddenly realizing that Ginny was a girl, and her making him crawl and humiliate himself for not noticing her sooner. That one really bugged me. The 'suddenly notices her' trope is okay, but the rest is just nasty and OOC. (Well, to be fair, more OOC for Harry than for Ginny. And I say this as a fan of Ginny.)
I think the popularity of livejournal has been very good for HP fandom, overall. It's allowed things to splinter and reduced the 'name' power of any given person. This does mean that it's hard to keep track of everything -- if you want to keep track of everything -- but it removes a lot of the pressure-cooker effects that made me uneasy back in 2002 and early 2003.
(no subject)
Date: 2006-06-22 01:13 am (UTC)Well, he more or less "suddenly notices her" in canon. >.>
Though if I were Harry, I would not find a girl wandering around in my socks all that sexy. Just sayin'. I notice you didn't mention them with what she'd wear, but why would she want his socks if she weren't going to wear them? She's not Dobby, after all... well, Dobby wears socks, just. liberally.
I really was oblivious to all of this! I just wanted to reeeeeead—man, I should hunt down the fics I remember liking before they all disappear into obscurity (I think I might be fortunate enough to be mostly fond of authors that are less likely to go the "ZOMG GOODBYE CRUEL INTERNETS <deletes everything and friendslocks!>" route but there's always losing interest in fandom and not maintaining websites. :3)
I used to be subscribed to several HP fic mls, but I purged just about all of them the last time I bothered looking at yahoogroups. On eljay, the only primarily-for-hp person I haunt is![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
copperbadge. Otherwise, I get the rare hp fic I read from ffn. :D;;
(no subject)
Date: 2006-06-23 07:07 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2006-06-22 05:29 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2006-06-22 10:57 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2006-06-23 03:33 pm (UTC)Anyway, going to the point: nice to have heard a bit more about you, it does make us understand a few things -tsss, good things, i say!
Hope you continue the guardian in spite of herself. And i pray you don't go the narusasu route :/
(no subject)
Date: 2006-06-23 07:12 pm (UTC)In any case, I like NaruSasuSaku better, because Naruto and Sasuke by themselves is a trainwreck waiting to happen. Or, you know, they could all three be platonic friends and teammates and go elsewhere for romance... though in canon that looks damn unlikely for Sakura, at least. *pets the poor obsessive ninja children*
I like not having OTPs because it lets me have the freedom to write and read so many more, and more varied, stories. Of course, it also means that I pine for more genfic, but we all have our problems. *sigh*