overly sanctimonious rules-lawyers and witch hunts

So does anyone know how, exactly, ff.net interprets their own posting rules? Particularly with regard to "Homestuck" fic? Because this afternoon I had the following exchange with a prissy rules-lawyer type, in regard to my story Me, Myself, and Die:


Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2012 10:56:06 -0700
From: MrGoodyTwoShoes ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/2107552/ )
-------------------

Entries not allowed:

1. Non-stories: lists, bloopers, polls, previews, challenges, author notes, and etc.
2. One or two liners.
3. MST: comments inserted in between the flow of a copied story.
4. Stories with non-historical and non-fictional characters: actors, musicians, and etc.
5. Any form of interactive entry: choose your adventure, second person/you based, Q&As, and etc.
6. Chat/script format and keyboard dialogue based entries.

Your story is not allowed under section 5 of the guidelines.

2nd point of view aka "you" based stories are not allowed on this website. I suggest switching to either first or third person perspective before someone comes along and reports you.

MGTS of Critics United

---------------
---------------
---------------

To which I responded as follows:

While your concern for proper procedure is admirable, you have misinterpreted the rules. Rule number 5 forbids INTERACTIVE entries, through which a writer solicits reader feedback to determine the content of the next chapter. Second person is a frequent SYMPTOM of such works, which is why it is listed as an example under section 5, but it is not in and of itself a determinant of interactivity (except insofar as ANY story demands the basic interactivity of a reader bringing the words to life in their own imagination). My story utilizes second person to add canon flavor, since Andrew Hussie's "Homestuck" is written in second person as a satire of text-based choose-your-adventure computer games, but my story is complete in and of itself and neither requests nor requires reader input for a continuation as there will never BE any continuation.

The "Homestuck" story I write that IS actually interactive has never and will never be posted on this site. Nor will the chatlog-based "Homestuck" stories. Because I do, in fact, read the rules. :-)

Cheers,
Liz

---------------
---------------
---------------

To which he responded:

You are misunderstanding the rule completely. Second person stories are not allowed here at all.

It doesn't matter what the source material is, the rules of the site say it's not allowed and you agreed to follow those rules before posting.

Heed me review or not but don't be shocked when your work is removed because you violated the rule of this site.

---------------
---------------
---------------

Now, first of all I am not inclined to listen to a guy whose review carries overtones of "do what I say or I will report you". He claims he doesn't report people himself, just points out problems that other may report (see his rules-lawyer account here), but given his paternalistic prescriptivism, I confess to having doubts. Also I stand by my interpretation of section 5 (which is a terribly-worded rule in any case).

BUT.

FF.net is notoriously idiosyncratic about which rules they enforce, what interpretation of their rules they enforce, when they enforce them, and whether they give any warning beforehand. I have had a story written in second person ("Knives") up on my account for YEARS with no complaints whatsoever. And I have a strong suspicion that this may be part of a campaign directed against Homestuck fandom in particular, since Homestuck has a large hatedom as well as a large fandom. But as I said, ff.net can decide to enforce completely random things for no reason.

Do you think I am correct in my interpretation?

---------------
---------------
---------------

ETA: Oh look, he's brought a friend!

Gaaras1Girl chimes in to say:

You based stories are not allowed, change the POV or be reported. Hint: All
you have to do is change the "you" to an "I" or make up a name.

-GG, Mod of Critics United

---------------
---------------
---------------

So this IS a threat, no matter what MrGoodyTwoShoes claims on his profile! Truth revealed!

(And Gaaras1Girl, did you even bother to read the story? The character HAS a name. It's Dave. That is explicit in the summary and the story, and nobody who knows the fandom would blink twice at it.)

...

Is this seriously the best use people can think of for their time? What kind of enjoyment do they even GET from this kind of witch-hunting???

...

I would write more but I have to go to work now.

full text of a letter I sent to ff.net support, calling out Critics United

To whom it may concern:

I would like to report a systematic pattern of abuse by a group of members calling themselves Critics United (http://www.fanfiction.net/forum/Critics-United/78623/). They are not, in fact, critics. What they are is a self-appointed police force who go around leaving bullying and intimidating reviews, and reporting stories they claim are in violation of site rules.

Many of their reports are accurate, but I would like to point out that they are persistently misinterpreting rule 5 of the "entries not allowed" section, which states that

5. Any form of interactive entry: choose your adventure, second person/you based, Q&As, and etc.

is not permitted on the site.

It seems obvious to me that the rule prohibits INTERACTIVE content, and the words after the colon are examples of things that may fall into that category. The problem is that -- and this is important -- NOT ALL SECOND PERSON STORIES ARE INTERACTIVE. Sometimes second person is simply a narrative choice. An interactive story is defined by a writer's attempt to solicit audience feedback to determine the content of the next chapter. Writing in second person does not, in and of itself, constitute such an attempt at interactivity.

This is particularly important with regard to Homestuck fandom. (http://www.fanfiction.net/comic/Homestuck/) Homestuck is written in the style of a second person choose-your-adventure computer game, because it is a satire of such games. Many fanfiction stories for Homestuck are therefore also written in second person, to more accurately mimic the flavor of canon.

Homestuck fics that use chatlogs or actively attempt to be a choose-your-adventure story are of course not allowed, as per rule 5 and rule 6. But Homestuck stories that tell a traditional narrative that happens to be in second person are not, in fact, violating the spirit of rule 5.

For example, I recently had two members of Critics United -- MrGoodyTwoShoes ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/2107552/ ) and Gaaras1Girl (http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1821929/) attempt to intimidate me into deleting my story "Me, Myself, and Die" (http://www.fanfiction.net/s/8616496/1/) on the grounds that it violates rule 5. Here is a copy of our correspondence:

( MrGoodyTwoShoes review and responses )

---------------
---------------

At this point Gaaras1Girl chimed in to say:

( Gaaras1Girl review and response )

---------------
---------------

I would also like to refer you to this topic thread in the Critics United forum, where it is clear that Gaaras1Girl did not have time to read my story before reviewing it, nor did she give me any time to read her review and respond before she leaped to report this so-called violation: http://www.fanfiction.net/topic/78623/29562573/59/Stories-in-Violation-CU-Members-Only. I will reproduce the text of the posts in question below:

MrGoodyTwoShoes
Story: Me, Myself, and Die Author: Elizabeth Culmer Fandom: Homestuck - "you" based story. Author argues it's allowed because the rule is about interactive fics only.
Reply Today 12:20PM . Edited 2 hours ago #2,943

Gaaras1Girl
Reviewed and reported.
Reply Today 12:22PM #2,944


The "today" in these posts is Wednesday, October 17, 2012. If you compare the timestamp of her post to the timestamp of her review, it becomes clear that Gaaras1Girl told MrGoodyTwoShoes that she had reported my story three minutes BEFORE she left her review in which she implied that she had NOT yet reported it. Therefore, her review to me was given under false pretenses -- it implicitly set up a "Follow my orders and I will not report you" situation, when in fact she had already filed a report.

Also note the next post in the topic thread, from MrGoodyTwoShoes:

MrGoodyTwoShoes
Story: Sister Blister Author: VirgoInDisguise Fandom: Homestuck - "you" based story. Author claims that because the webcomic is written like that then it's ok despite the claims they also read the rules before blocking me. I suspect this one is block happy.
This claim about the source material seems to be one of the excuses these kids will use so be ready for it.
Reply Today 1:56PM . Edited 2 hours ago #2,945

As you can see, Critics United has become aware of Homestuck fandom and seems to be preparing to target Homestuck stories and authors en masse under pretext of their misinterpretation of rule 5. To prevent this attack, I would like to respectfully request that rule 5 be reworded to clarify that it applies strictly to INTERACTIVE works and is not a blanket prohibition on the use of second person as a narrative technique, and also that a mod contact Critics United and tell them to stop trying to enforce their incorrect interpretation of the rule on other members of this site.

Sincerely,
Elizabeth Culmer (http://www.fanfiction.net/u/461224/Elizabeth_Culmer)
Member since 2003