overly sanctimonious rules-lawyers and witch hunts

[edenfalling]

So does anyone know how, exactly, ff.net interprets their own posting rules? Particularly with regard to "Homestuck" fic? Because this afternoon I had the following exchange with a prissy rules-lawyer type, in regard to my story Me, Myself, and Die:


Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2012 10:56:06 -0700
From: MrGoodyTwoShoes ( http://www.fanfiction.net/u/2107552/ )
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Entries not allowed:

1. Non-stories: lists, bloopers, polls, previews, challenges, author notes, and etc.
2. One or two liners.
3. MST: comments inserted in between the flow of a copied story.
4. Stories with non-historical and non-fictional characters: actors, musicians, and etc.
5. Any form of interactive entry: choose your adventure, second person/you based, Q&As, and etc.
6. Chat/script format and keyboard dialogue based entries.

Your story is not allowed under section 5 of the guidelines.

2nd point of view aka "you" based stories are not allowed on this website. I suggest switching to either first or third person perspective before someone comes along and reports you.

MGTS of Critics United

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To which I responded as follows:

While your concern for proper procedure is admirable, you have misinterpreted the rules. Rule number 5 forbids INTERACTIVE entries, through which a writer solicits reader feedback to determine the content of the next chapter. Second person is a frequent SYMPTOM of such works, which is why it is listed as an example under section 5, but it is not in and of itself a determinant of interactivity (except insofar as ANY story demands the basic interactivity of a reader bringing the words to life in their own imagination). My story utilizes second person to add canon flavor, since Andrew Hussie's "Homestuck" is written in second person as a satire of text-based choose-your-adventure computer games, but my story is complete in and of itself and neither requests nor requires reader input for a continuation as there will never BE any continuation.

The "Homestuck" story I write that IS actually interactive has never and will never be posted on this site. Nor will the chatlog-based "Homestuck" stories. Because I do, in fact, read the rules. :-)

Cheers,
Liz

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To which he responded:

You are misunderstanding the rule completely. Second person stories are not allowed here at all.

It doesn't matter what the source material is, the rules of the site say it's not allowed and you agreed to follow those rules before posting.

Heed me review or not but don't be shocked when your work is removed because you violated the rule of this site.

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Now, first of all I am not inclined to listen to a guy whose review carries overtones of "do what I say or I will report you". He claims he doesn't report people himself, just points out problems that other may report (see his rules-lawyer account here), but given his paternalistic prescriptivism, I confess to having doubts. Also I stand by my interpretation of section 5 (which is a terribly-worded rule in any case).

BUT.

FF.net is notoriously idiosyncratic about which rules they enforce, what interpretation of their rules they enforce, when they enforce them, and whether they give any warning beforehand. I have had a story written in second person ("Knives") up on my account for YEARS with no complaints whatsoever. And I have a strong suspicion that this may be part of a campaign directed against Homestuck fandom in particular, since Homestuck has a large hatedom as well as a large fandom. But as I said, ff.net can decide to enforce completely random things for no reason.

Do you think I am correct in my interpretation?

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ETA: Oh look, he's brought a friend!

Gaaras1Girl chimes in to say:

You based stories are not allowed, change the POV or be reported. Hint: All
you have to do is change the "you" to an "I" or make up a name.

-GG, Mod of Critics United

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So this IS a threat, no matter what MrGoodyTwoShoes claims on his profile! Truth revealed!

(And Gaaras1Girl, did you even bother to read the story? The character HAS a name. It's Dave. That is explicit in the summary and the story, and nobody who knows the fandom would blink twice at it.)

...

Is this seriously the best use people can think of for their time? What kind of enjoyment do they even GET from this kind of witch-hunting???

...

I would write more but I have to go to work now.

Comments

[lady_songsmith]

I'd be seriously tempted to preemptively report them for spamming/harassment or something like that. I don't think the rule in any way intends to block all fic written in 2nd person POV, and if they think that, they are seriously in need of a critical reading review.

Oh, you've been reported, hon. They have a forum where they sic one another on fics. Yours is here, toward the bottom:
http://www.fanfiction.net/topic/78623/29562573/59/Stories-in-Violation-CU-Members-Only

MGTS: Story: Me, Myself, and Die Author: Elizabeth Culmer Fandom: Homestruck - "you" based story. Author argues it's allowed because the rule is about interactive fics only.
GG: Reviewed and reported.

followed by another fic who mentioned the canon and the comment "This claim about the source material seems to be one of the excuses these kids will use so be ready for it."

Oh, one more thing found trawling through their boards (god, does MGTS do anything but poke fic? he's got another comm just like this one, too). They have an "explanation" of why 2nd-person fics are against the rules, which boils down to "they can be kiddie porn if someone underage reads them!" and the interactive thing. *facepalming forever*

[edenfalling]

I did report them for abusive and bullying behavior, and requested a clarification of rule 5 while I was at it. I doubt it will do much good, but at least I have put my side of the story out there. *sigh*

MGTS claims he writes fic under a different penname, but given how prolific he is at generating "violation" complaints, I am inclined to doubt it. That or he flat-out has no life... which, come to think of it, might explain why he feels a need to boost his ego by acting as a "guardian" of orthodoxy.

And yeah, this group fails critical reading forever. :-(

[lady_songsmith]

I looked through their "member list" and a LOT of them are CU-only accounts that claim to write fic under other names, but won't say what those are. Some of them say it's so their fic-writing account won't get "picked on" by people angry about the CU stuff. I expect some of them actually do write, but I for one don't take writing critique from someone with no credentials. They like to argue that "you don't need to have made films to review them" but you do need some bona fides if you want anyone to give a damn about your reviews, and they don't have any. They cite Ebert like he he was some joe off the street and didn't have a career and degrees in journalism before he started as a critic.

So I notice the two reviews are off your story - though they've got a new one poking you - I take it that's a good sign and ff.net might be listening?

[edenfalling]

I don't know, but I'm going to report them again and point out MrGoodyTwoShoes's new post in that thread that basically invites his fellow "critics" to dogpile on the Homestuck fandom. If that is not classic bullying behavior, I don't know what is.